Roseanne Season 11

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anonymousrus
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Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 5:27 pm

Roseanne Season 11

Postby anonymousrus » Fri Sep 14, 2018 9:29 pm

I posted this as a response to the 'resolved' thread concerning this matter, but since that forum is not regularly monitored for replies, I'll repost here.

I was the one who created Season 11 for "Roseanne," which was deleted because the series is shifting to "The Conners" following the ousting of star Roseanne Barr from the program.

While it's true that "Roseanne" was 'cancelled', there is precedent for keeping sequel series - even renamed series - the same in the database. Look at "The Hogan Family," which was in a similar position to Roseanne. It was originally called Valerie, but after the first season, star Valerie Harper left the series, and it was renamed Valerie's family, then finally The Hogan Family (https://www.thetvdb.com/series/the-hogan-family). Additionally, we also have a similar situation with The Golden Girls, which lasted for 7 seasons, then switched networks and titles for "The Golden Palace," which is listed as season 8 here on thetvdb because it serves as a continuation of the original series after Bea Arthur left (https://www.thetvdb.com/series/the-gold ... /seasons/8). If we want to go waaay back, a similar thing happened with Danny Thomas's "Make Room for Daddy," which lost its co-star after season 3 and changed its name to "The Danny Thomas Show" for the remaining seasons (https://www.thetvdb.com/series/make-room-for-daddy).

None of these are considered separate series because they are direct continuations of the original series, just as "The Conners" is a direct continuation of "Roseanne."

"The Conners" continues the story set up in "Roseanne" after its main character leaves the show. It appears to me that this show should be treated in the same way as the many examples of show continuations and sequels, not as a totally separate spinoff (even if the news is referring to it as a spinoff because of the situation surrounding its creation).

anonymousrus
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Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 5:27 pm

Re: Roseanne Season 11

Postby anonymousrus » Sat Sep 15, 2018 8:29 am

Also, here is the discussion and hikaricore's explanation of the official rules for these situations in a thread about Power Rangers: viewtopic.php?f=18&t=16774&p=61738#p61738

Maretoh
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Location: France

Re: Roseanne Season 11

Postby Maretoh » Sat Sep 15, 2018 12:55 pm

Meta-series such as Power Rangers is a whole different thing.
The Conners isn't the direct continuity of Roseanne, it's a spin-off and as such it's listed separately.
It was in the works before the debacle, and if Roseanne hadn't be cancelled, both shows could've maybe coexisted.
An episode a day keeps the doctor away.

anonymousrus
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Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 5:27 pm

Re: Roseanne Season 11

Postby anonymousrus » Sat Sep 15, 2018 1:08 pm

Maretoh wrote:Meta-series such as Power Rangers is a whole different thing.
The Conners isn't the direct continuity of Roseanne, it's a spin-off and as such it's listed separately.
It was ordered before the debacle, and if Roseanne hadn't be cancelled, both shows would've coexisted.


No. Roseanne was renewed for an 11th season. That season would have naturally followed Roseanne, Dan, Jackie, the kids, etc. When Barr was fired, they regrouped the show as The Conners - with the same characters. It was never ordered before Roseanne was fired (which happened on May 29). It was officially ordered on June 21. The Conners would not have co-existed with Roseanne... that wouldn't even make sense. Roseanne and Dan are the Conners. There was no talk of a spin-off before the drama.

https://tvline.com/2018/06/21/roseanne- ... t-darlene/

With all the same characters, the same premise, and the same setting, I'm not sure how this is different from, say, Valerie/Valerie's Family/The Hogan Family or The Golden Girls/The Golden Palace or Make Room for Daddy/The Danny Thomas Show or The Torkelsons/Almost Home or another half dozen shows I can think of off the top of my head.

anonymousrus
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Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 5:27 pm

Re: Roseanne Season 11

Postby anonymousrus » Sat Sep 15, 2018 1:14 pm

Also, I know that Power Rangers, etc. are a different animal. But given that the wiki is offline, I was referring to the rule policy stated in that thread. I've copied it here. Roseanne/The Conners clearly falls within the merge category:

Todo: Exact specifications for the handling of sequel type series and clarification of what should and should not be merged.

Should be merged:

Direct Sequels (shows that are renamed per season or for whatever reason but continue and existing plot or show another side of the same story)
Aqua Teen Hunger Force/Aqua Unit Patrol Squad 1
Torchwood/Torchwood: Children of Earth/Torchwood: Miracle Day
Sailor Moon/Sailor Moon R/Sailor Moon S/Sailor Moon SuperS/Sailor Moon Sailor Stars
Hell Girl/Hell Girl: Two Mirrors/Hell Girl: Three Vessels
Higurashi no Naku Koroni/Higurashi no Naku Koroni Kai/Higurashi no Naku Koroni Rei

Indirect Sequels (this is where a show is not always a direct continuation but is considered part of an overall larger series)
Super Sentai (35 series) | Kamen Rider (22 series) | Power Rangers (18 series) | Underbelly (5 series)


Should not be merged (provided that they are an entire series which aired or streamed and not a special/ova/etc):

Alternate Universe (same/like characters in a different setting. Mai-Otome is an alternate universe version of My-HiME)
Spin-Offs (such as Railgun is a spinoff of Index | The Cleveland Show / Family Guy)
Re-Tellings (Tenchi Universe is a re-telling of Tenchi Muyo! Ryo-Ohki | Full Metal Alchemist: Brotherhood / Full Metal Alchemist | Dragon Ball Kai / Dragon Ball Z)
Re-Imaginings (Battlestar Galactica (2003) is a re-imagining of the original Battlestar Galactica)


Rare exceptions to the rule:

Very large or long-running series which are technically sequels but have been determined in the past to be better off being split:
Doctor Who (160 episodes over 26 years)/Doctor Who (2005) (a fairly definitive example of this exception)
**update** On the new site the following two examples may be merged depending on mod/admin consensus and the availability of better tools for doing so.
Dragon Ball (153 episodes over 3 years)/ Dragon Ball Z (291 episodes over 7 years)/ Dragon Ball GT
Naruto (220 episodes over 5 years)/Naruto Shippuuden

Maretoh
Posts: 3140
Joined: Sat Mar 07, 2015 8:19 am
Location: France

Re: Roseanne Season 11

Postby Maretoh » Sat Sep 15, 2018 1:16 pm

It's officially presented as a spin-off and it will stay as is.
https://abc.go.com/shows/abc-new-shows/ ... -this-fall
An episode a day keeps the doctor away.

anonymousrus
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Jun 10, 2014 5:27 pm

Re: Roseanne Season 11

Postby anonymousrus » Sat Sep 15, 2018 1:21 pm

Maretoh wrote:It's officially presented as a spin-off and it will stay as is.
https://abc.go.com/shows/abc-new-shows/ ... -this-fall


That's fine. Please update the policies to reflect this, though. I gave many examples where shows in similar situations are merged because it's effectively the same show. There should be some consistency here.

Wolfie
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue Mar 10, 2015 9:34 pm

Re: Roseanne Season 11

Postby Wolfie » Fri Oct 26, 2018 4:33 pm

(I know I'm late on this discussion, but in case anyone else comes across it and wonders...)

The policies don't support your argument. Yes, Roseanne was initially renewed for another season, but then after Roseanne stirred up controversy, the show was canceled. The Conners was created strictly as a spin-off, not a sequel, even though it is a continuation of the show. I don't see any inconsistency here.