Vic & Bob's Big Night Out is not Vic Reeves Big Night Out

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hdurdle
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:10 pm

Thu Nov 29, 2018 2:55 am

The new show - on the BBC - "Vic & Bob's Big Night Out" has been added as season 3 of the Channel 4 show from the 90s "Vic Reeves Big Night Out".

They're related, but different shows, separated by two decades and an entirely different channel.

This: https://www.thetvdb.com/series/vic-reev ... /seasons/3

Should be season 1 of a new show called 'Vic & Bob's Big Night Out' :
https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b ... -episode-1
Cafeine
Posts: 685
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:02 am
Location: Le Mans

Thu Nov 29, 2018 4:54 am

I second that motion.

I'll add a new entry for Vic & Bob's Big Night Out

Season 3 of Vic Reeves Big Night Out #78264 should be removed.

Thanks :)
Cafeine
Posts: 685
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:02 am
Location: Le Mans

Thu Nov 29, 2018 5:20 am

I wasn't able to add the new entry for Vic & Bob's Big Night Out, as the search says that series already exists, even though it doesn't appear in any search result… :/
(Incidentally, it's not the first time that already existing entries don't appear in search results.)

Image

I did find that entry with the slug (Vic & Bob's Big Night Out), but the non efficient search is troubling.^^
BagronkeN
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 1:38 pm

Sun Dec 09, 2018 3:27 pm

There are now triplicates of the "new" show:

https://www.thetvdb.com/series/vic-and- ... -night-out (ID 355981)

https://www.thetvdb.com/series/vic-and- ... ht-out-new (ID 356122)

https://www.thetvdb.com/series/vic-and- ... -night-out (ID 356225)

The last two pages should definitely be removed, and I also think the "new" show should be treated as a new season of the old show, due to:

1) Channel changes should however not make a difference, several shows change channels without us making duplicate pages for them (just look at Big Brother for example).

2) Time passed since last season is also irrelevant (just look at Twin Peaks for example).

3) The format of the show is exactly the same, and stars the same two people as before (Vic and Bob). There is a slight change of the name of the show, but is negligible as it refers to the same person (Vic Reeves) and just adds in Bob's name this time around.

Mods should have the final say I guess, but since it's the same show (same format, same people), my vote is to remove all three of the new pages above, and instead add "Vic & Bob's Big Night Out" as an alias to the old one.

Cheers!
Cafeine
Posts: 685
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:02 am
Location: Le Mans

Wed Dec 19, 2018 6:39 pm

I disagree.
First and foremost: and also:
  • Not the same channel
    Not the same cast
    Not the same production team
    Not the same production company
Conan is not The Tonight Show with Conan O'Brien or Late Night with Conan O'Brien ;)
BagronkeN
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 1:38 pm

Thu Dec 20, 2018 7:05 am

Just to add my comments on this:
  • Title change has been discussed above and makes perfect sense, and is basically the same.

    The British Comedy Guide is not official in any way (since non-UK mods probably doesn't know about this site).

    IMDb is not official either (as mods know), and often have two different entries when TVDB does not (see Twin Peaks example).

    Channel change is irrelevant, TVDB lists original channel, and a lot of shows change channel or are broadcast on several channels.

    Same main cast, and is irrelevant anyway since cast changes from season to season on many other shows.

    A lot of shows change production teams/company season to season, and should be irrelevant to TVDB.
Not saying this system is perfect, but the Conan example is flawed since the main part about these shows are the "The Tonight Show" and "Late Night" distinguishables, which are hallmarks of US TV talkshow history ;)
Cafeine
Posts: 685
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:02 am
Location: Le Mans

Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:13 am

OK, but what about So Graham Norton, V Graham Norton, The Graham Norton Effect and The Graham Norton Show, then? ;)

More seriously, when the title is not the same and when the channel is part of another network, then, officially and legally, it's two different shows, isn't it?
BagronkeN
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 1:38 pm

Fri Dec 21, 2018 6:12 am

Again, not saying the TVDB system is perfect and that it has been followed 100% in the past (especially with non-US shows), but according to the guidelines set by TVDB, these two entries should (most probably) be the same show.

However, (slight) title and channel/networks changes do not affect the guidelines, and whatever is "official" (or "legal", whatever that means) according to someone else does not affect TVDB. The official ruling for TVDB is determined by the guidelines and enacted by the mods, simple as that :)

The thing we should do to help their process is add input to the points that do matter for the title in question according to the TVDB guidelines, and I think we've both done that already.
Cafeine
Posts: 685
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 10:02 am
Location: Le Mans

Wed Jan 02, 2019 8:07 am

This matter has been resolved in a newest topic : viewtopic.php?f=18&t=53064
Thanks for that :)

The present topic can be be moved to "Resolved" as well.
Mistywing
Site Moderator
Posts: 1612
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2016 11:59 pm

Wed Jan 02, 2019 1:47 pm

I could be wrong with this decision but I went with the following reasoning:

Vic Reeves' is still being streamed on the Channel 4 platform
Vic & Bob's is being streamed on BBC 4

I'm not from the UK so I obviously can't watch the public TV there, but that seems to indicate that both networks still retain the airing rights of the different series.
If that is the case this probably isn't a series changing networks like mentioned before as a reason to support the older entry S3.

It seemed more like a reboot to me, and we certainly list a few of those separately.
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